How Doctors feel about Obamacare

[callmeslick]

Peanuts is what your version of Healthcare will pay them.....not mine.

For the record, this is a lively discussion in my opinion....I am enjoying it, Thanx.

show me where they are going to get peanuts(I know, you're using a turn of phrase, I don't expect to see a wording involving Planter's or Mr. Peanut). I suspect they will end up with a perfectly adequate salary, we simply won't need as many, thus, won't need to import half of Pakistan's output.

And yes, it has been a good exchange, and civil(Wullie, ya out there?), by my definition of civil.
Unfortunately, due to several early rises at 4 am, due to weather(not whining, just stating reality), this member of the healthcare juggernaut is off to bed. To be continued, I suspect, later......

[Wullie]

"The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism, but under the name of liberalism they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program until one day America will be a socialist nation without ever knowing how it happened."
Norman Thomas, American socialist

I hope I'm dead by then.

[callmeslick]

"The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism, but under the name of liberalism they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program until one day America will be a socialist nation without ever knowing how it happened."
Norman Thomas, American socialist

I hope I'm dead by then.

unless you are typing while deceased, you won't be. To some extent we have had socialist policies since the adoption of a graduated income tax.

[CUDA]

You know WHY Doctors don't like this plan? Because it drives down costs. One of the key cost drivers is excessive doctor visits and excessive specialist work(ie-unnecessary testing and surgery). I just heard a report about one of the small-scale test studies(funded by the Healthcare act, by the way) in Atlantic City, New Jersey. They have, to date(and this started before the bill, with outside funding by state of NJ, and others), lowered healthcare costs by nearly 20%, with a small(but apparently statistically significant) rise in positive outcomes. Who doesn't like that...better health at lower cost? Apparently, specialists, notable among them cardiologists and neurologists, who have seen patient visits plummet among the test group.
Hmmmm. Maybe a world with less specialists, more primary care physicians and lower overall costs is achievable. If only folks would open their eyes and minds to the possibilities.

that sounds like the insurance industry. I work in the auto collision industry. essentially health care for your car. and what you just described IS NOT A GOOD THING, I CONSTANTLY have insurance companies mandating I use inferior parts IE not factory, to "lower the costs" I constantly have insurance companies refusing to pay for proceedeure necessary to return the vehicle to the condition it was before the accident to "lower the costs" THIS IS A BAD THING. what you end up with is a vehicle the is not fixed correctly because your insurances dont want to pay for to fix your car properly so they can "lower the costs" healthcare will be the same thing you will end up with a bunch of sick, improperly diagnosed, or botched surguries because they wished to "lower the costs" of your health care

[Buzz]

I get a shot in my lower back every 2 months. The doctor walks in the room with the shot in his hand.

He says "Hi Pete"

I say "Hi Doc"

I point to the spot on my back.

He sticks in the needle, and then walks out saying "See you next time Pete"

I say "Ok Doc"


He was in the room no more than 2 minutes.

The charge? $380 and $150 for the shot. ( I don't pay for it)

I don't have much sympathy for doctors working for less.

[Pudfark]

"The charge? $380 and $150 for the shot. ( I don't pay for it)"

Not trying to pry? Who does pay for it?

[callmeslick]

You know WHY Doctors don't like this plan? Because it drives down costs. One of the key cost drivers is excessive doctor visits and excessive specialist work(ie-unnecessary testing and surgery). I just heard a report about one of the small-scale test studies(funded by the Healthcare act, by the way) in Atlantic City, New Jersey. They have, to date(and this started before the bill, with outside funding by state of NJ, and others), lowered healthcare costs by nearly 20%, with a small(but apparently statistically significant) rise in positive outcomes. Who doesn't like that...better health at lower cost? Apparently, specialists, notable among them cardiologists and neurologists, who have seen patient visits plummet among the test group.
Hmmmm. Maybe a world with less specialists, more primary care physicians and lower overall costs is achievable. If only folks would open their eyes and minds to the possibilities.

that sounds like the insurance industry. I work in the auto collision industry. essentially health care for your car. and what you just described IS NOT A GOOD THING, I CONSTANTLY have insurance companies mandating I use inferior parts IE not factory, to "lower the costs" I constantly have insurance companies refusing to pay for proceedeure necessary to return the vehicle to the condition it was before the accident to "lower the costs" THIS IS A BAD THING. what you end up with is a vehicle the is not fixed correctly because your insurances dont want to pay for to fix your car properly so they can "lower the costs" healthcare will be the same thing you will end up with a bunch of sick, improperly diagnosed, or botched surguries because they wished to "lower the costs" of your health care

I understand your analogy, but it is dead wrong when applied to healthcare. Imagine a system where you have to take every oil change to a racing motor shop. That would be similar. No one is saying to not have specialists, but our current system utilizes FAR too many specialists for no good end, and far too few primary care doctors and nurse-practitioners. Similar analogies could be given with unnecessary testing and imaging.

[Buzz]

"The charge? $380 and $150 for the shot. ( I don't pay for it)"

Not trying to pry? Who does pay for it?

My insurance.

Not Medicare.

[CUDA]

You know WHY Doctors don't like this plan? Because it drives down costs. One of the key cost drivers is excessive doctor visits and excessive specialist work(ie-unnecessary testing and surgery). I just heard a report about one of the small-scale test studies(funded by the Healthcare act, by the way) in Atlantic City, New Jersey. They have, to date(and this started before the bill, with outside funding by state of NJ, and others), lowered healthcare costs by nearly 20%, with a small(but apparently statistically significant) rise in positive outcomes. Who doesn't like that...better health at lower cost? Apparently, specialists, notable among them cardiologists and neurologists, who have seen patient visits plummet among the test group.
Hmmmm. Maybe a world with less specialists, more primary care physicians and lower overall costs is achievable. If only folks would open their eyes and minds to the possibilities.

that sounds like the insurance industry. I work in the auto collision industry. essentially health care for your car. and what you just described IS NOT A GOOD THING, I CONSTANTLY have insurance companies mandating I use inferior parts IE not factory, to "lower the costs" I constantly have insurance companies refusing to pay for proceedeure necessary to return the vehicle to the condition it was before the accident to "lower the costs" THIS IS A BAD THING. what you end up with is a vehicle the is not fixed correctly because your insurances dont want to pay for to fix your car properly so they can "lower the costs" healthcare will be the same thing you will end up with a bunch of sick, improperly diagnosed, or botched surguries because they wished to "lower the costs" of your health care

I understand your analogy, but it is dead wrong when applied to healthcare. Imagine a system where you have to take every oil change to a racing motor shop. That would be similar. No one is saying to not have specialists, but our current system utilizes FAR too many specialists for no good end, and far too few primary care doctors and nurse-practitioners. Similar analogies could be given with unnecessary testing and imaging.

My analogy is Completely valid. this is not about WHO does the repairs. it's about WHO'S authorizing those repairs and WHO'S paying for those repairs. this is about Insurance companies refusing to pay for proceedures that they dont want to pay for or THEY deem un-necessary to "control costs". so it is the company that controls the purse strings making the decisions over the type of medical care you get instead of the Doctor that has examined you.
My 2nd daughter is an Insurance biller for a Local Urologist, she is telling me the same stories that I tell her regarding insurance companies

[ruggbutt]

Just got off the phone with a buddy of mine who is a hostpital adminstrator for Banner. I pointed him to this thread. He wanted to know who the dumbfuck was who's name was Slick. Seriously.